Johno3 Posted December 19, 2009 Report Posted December 19, 2009 Hello Guys, I am hoping tomorrow to get a few drivers together and continuing with the ongoing tyre testing. Starting at 8:30pm, I am hoping to do a tarmac track tour, with a little time for practice and then a perhaps a race. Admin have not decided what to do so far. As I said in the otehr thread, Hednesford was positive, Skegness was mixed, and we will run the same at Birmingham on Thursday. I would like to try out some more tracks tomorrow night. We are trying to maintain a balance here. Do as much testing to make an informed decision, but at the same time, give you enough time to practice if we do decide to change things. Therefore what we need is a little help. Thanks to all those drivers that have left feedback for us so far. It is very much apptraciated. Cheers Johno
Tosh924 Posted December 20, 2009 Report Posted December 20, 2009 will we make this thread a booking list for numbers johno for tonight? if so Tosh247
Johno3 Posted December 20, 2009 Author Report Posted December 20, 2009 So what do we think tonight then? We have had a tour around the tracks, so if possible, I would like some of your thoughts. I think it does exactly as it should do - it allows people to drive with the backend out and be quick early on in a race, but then it makes it harder for them. It works opposite for those drivers that drive straight. I would also be curious to know if people changed their set ups? I think that if this was confirmed, this is what people would need to do. So thoughts welcomed... Cheers Johno
MoR137 Posted December 20, 2009 Report Posted December 20, 2009 Well, I got chance to have a look at the x2 tyre wear tonight, and here are my thoughts... TBH, my opinions on this are much the same as Dazza's when it comes down to how will this improve the racing. The problem there isn't with the physics/tyres, it's with the driver's, and tonights practice did confirm that in many ways (baring in mind of course that people were quite relaxed tonight; a few bigger hits than normal). Driving standards have always been a problem on UKDirt and probably every other online racing league, and no amount of server settings, physics changes or mod changes will ever change that. Half the problem is that stupid mentality people seem to get about them of 'ah well everyone else is doing it so I might aswell do it myself'.... doesn't solve anything and is half the reason stupid driving stays around. I'm digressing a little, so I suppose I better get back on topic.... It would be silly for me to say there isn't an issue with the physics if what your after is complete and utter realism - now the ultimate pace has been found, it's obvious that getting it a little bit sideways is the fastest way around. Can that be cured? Most likely, but IMO, x2 tyre wear isnt the way to go about it. At some point down the line the physics may need reviewing, but as Grasser already said, that isn't going to happen for 2010. What really got my back up about the previous thread is the fact that some people seem to have gotten a little spoilt by the occasional physics changes in mods like Rods/F2s that they seem to believe that there has to be changes in the F1s aswell. That's daft, and threatening to not race unless it happens is even dafter. So why don't I like tyre wear set at x2? I think the current tyre wear setting is fine. Maybe it's just me, as I do drive quite hard, but if I've had a fast/hectic race, with a few hits sending me wide etc, the tyres are pretty worn for the last 5 or 6 laps of the race. I'm happy with that - I've really pushed it, so I deserve the handicap of the tyres going off on me. With the server setting at x2, I found the wear suddenly snaps - one half spin and your tyres have had it, race over. Bit frustrating if that happens when it is most likely to happen; at the start of the race. The idea of saving and conserving tyres is not one I personally associate with the F1s, and it's not one that I find remotely interesting or fun. If I want to watch my tyre temperatures, I'd go race a circuit racing mod - for me F1s are about driving the fastest and hardest I can on a tiny little track, not worrying that my tyres might go off if I overshoot the next bend trying to hit somebody. The controversial Wimbledon meeting last year proved (to me) that pansying about worrying about tiny little things like crossing white lines (or in this case, tyres) isn't a fun way to race stockcars. For me, it's boring. I'm quite concerned that if this change does come in, how it will effect the league in the long term. How will people feel about it once we are out of the initial honeymoon period? I have concerns that it might make a real mess of the grades for the first couple of months (with whites and yellows jumping to a maximum of 3 grades, with others only dropping a maximum of one) and I really think it will make spinning even more common. I also think that the mod is already on the borderline of inaccessibility for some and this will only exaggerate that. Tonight I tried allsorts with my setup tonight and found some things that worked and some that didn't. I won a couple of races, but I only won these because of how much carnage was going on. Was this because of the relaxed practice attitude, or was this because people were struggling with the cars? I think having tyre wear x2 = carnage x2. I feel it will be a step back for a league which has just started to gain popularity, and whether or not the drifting issue bothers you is a subjective matter. Tyre wear x2 - not for me I'm afraid....
Budge313 Posted December 21, 2009 Report Posted December 21, 2009 The idea of saving and conserving tyres is not one I personally associate with the F1s, and it's not one that I find remotely interesting or fun. If I want to watch my tyre temperatures, I'd go race a circuit racing mod - for me F1s are about driving the fastest and hardest I can on a tiny little track, not worrying that my tyres might go off if I overshoot the next bend trying to hit somebody. The controversial Wimbledon meeting last year proved (to me) that pansying about worrying about tiny little things like crossing white lines (or in this case, tyres) isn't a fun way to race stockcars. For me, it's boring. Tyre wear x2 - not for me I'm afraid.... Couldn't agree more with that statement I don't race F1 r factor and did very little heat F1... But i came for a play last, rightly or wrongly i don't know seemed to upset a few (nothing new there) i personally found them nearly impossible to control after 7-8 laps, so in a way i pointed it down the straights and found some at the bend to stop me, now with the new trye wear for a novice like me it would put me off racing F1, and many more i would imagine, the people who can race with that tyre wear, well good luck to you and well done, But do you want to race the same drivers week in week out, all going slower to save your tyres all on the same pace ????? to me that would be a bit boring and the driver base will slowly but surely drop off..... IMO if you leave the tryes alone, you will get the lower grades each week, that must offer more of a challenge than saving your tyres... ???? Sorry to anyone i upset last night (pedz, mor, mav, well most of you there) Budge
samson Posted December 21, 2009 Report Posted December 21, 2009 The idea of saving and conserving tyres is not one I personally associate with the F1s, and it's not one that I find remotely interesting or fun. If I want to watch my tyre temperatures, I'd go race a circuit racing mod - for me F1s are about driving the fastest and hardest I can on a tiny little track, not worrying that my tyres might go off if I overshoot the next bend trying to hit somebody. The controversial Wimbledon meeting last year proved (to me) that pansying about worrying about tiny little things like crossing white lines (or in this case, tyres) isn't a fun way to race stockcars. For me, it's boring. Tyre wear x2 - not for me I'm afraid.... Couldn't agree more with that statement I don't race F1 r factor and did very little heat F1... But i came for a play last, rightly or wrongly i don't know seemed to upset a few (nothing new there) i personally found them nearly impossible to control after 7-8 laps, so in a way i pointed it down the straights and found some at the bend to stop me, now with the new trye wear for a novice like me it would put me off racing F1, and many more i would imagine, the people who can race with that tyre wear, well good luck to you and well done, But do you want to race the same drivers week in week out, all going slower to save your tyres all on the same pace ????? to me that would be a bit boring and the driver base will slowly but surely drop off..... IMO if you leave the tryes alone, you will get the lower grades each week, that must offer more of a challenge than saving your tyres... ???? Sorry to anyone i upset last night (pedz, mor, mav, well most of you there) Budge Budge bud we all know you well enough now take your hits with a pinch of salt bud give as good as you get lol all in good spirit eh i personally don't like the tyre wear i just love hanging the arse out lol but on the tyre wear i reckon it also depends on the track for the different wear on the tyres i felt the tyre wear worse at some tracks were alot more than others and i was on default setup all night with no adjustments
wrighty496 Posted December 21, 2009 Report Posted December 21, 2009 .....i reckon it also depends on the track for the different wear on the tyres i felt the tyre wear worse at some tracks were alot more than others and i was on default setup all night with no adjustments well spotted.....we're now discovering with the f2 tyre and physics testing how much the tracks do vary in terms of not just the overall grip level but also a parameter called 'resistance'....you can have a high grip track with low resistance (basically, resistance is the friction as opposed to the grip.....i think) and the tyres behave entirely differently from a low grip/high resistance track would. That's one of the biggest problems with trying to develop the physics to suit existing tracks that have been made by different groups who have their own standards, methods of testing, checking, laptime-matching etc etc....there's no 'right answer' for track physics and therefore modifying cars to suit is always a moving target, whereby cars can feel spot on at one track and bloody awful at the next one. Completely off-topic but not, i suppose
Mav Posted December 21, 2009 Report Posted December 21, 2009 I found it difficult to get laps in whereby I could tell if the way I drove affected the tyre wear. It was hectic at times, and yes the constant hits after you had just past cars did get annoying, but however the physics are, I just try to drive. I wanted to try and change my corner angle and speeds to see what effect it had, but I guess this would only be possible if you are the only car on track. As you would expect, I do agree that the physics don't matter a great deal, apart from damage and make up of the car, its how the cars are driven. If people want to do what Budge did, they can, the physics won't stop that, and the more worn out the tyres become, the more they would turn to doing this style of driving as they know that they are not going to get back into contention for a place. If the tyre wear was to stay on x2, then people would adapt over time, as they would with any change to the game. TomD has won, MOR has won, Tosh has won, so it is possible from the back especially if the mid-field pack start belting each other. Saying that it would put newbies off for me is not right. If you want to drive these you will whatever the physics, people will help out and they will learn. rFactor will not be mastered overnight like Heat could be. Personally, I like to drive the car, not race it. I am not interested in belting the car in front, (thats not to say I won't do it from time to time), I prefer to be raced against, pushed wide by a faster car to make a race of it, knowing that I won't retaliate next bend with a big hit, there may be a hit but not a race ending one. All this helps me get the car to the end of the race, so even with high tyre wear, I can cope - just!; after all I did win a final using this strategy and not from the very front before you say!!!! Endurance not a sprint for me. So Summing up, whatever the car physics, I will drive a style to suit and learn to manage the situation as it arises.
drumbstick Posted December 21, 2009 Report Posted December 21, 2009 I couldn't agree more with what Mor said. The biggest thing for me is 1 big slide or half spin cooks the tyres and you never get them back after that.
Tosh924 Posted December 21, 2009 Report Posted December 21, 2009 I couldn't agree more with what Mor said. The biggest thing for me is 1 big slide or half spin cooks the tyres and you never get them back after that. spot on drumb and......... MOR,s post quite simply said it all for me aswell.
Nezza46 Posted December 21, 2009 Report Posted December 21, 2009 must admit Budge has it spot on for me as I am a newbie to the f1s as well. I have always struggled to control these f1's which has stopped me from racing them in the past. However, after racing f2's and nz's with more and more control I felt that it was time to give them another go. I did some practise in the servers when they were on normal settings and actually found I could get round skeggy ok, which is why i thought i would race the winter series for some experience, but still struggled with the extra power on shale so thought about doing tar only for the time being. Tuesday I nipped in to the server with x2 tyre wear on and hated it to be honest. The car lost grip after 6-7 laps and I found myself spinning it too much. I then lost interest after about 30 mins and gave up again. so from mine and budges point of view, it just isnt newbie friendly.
Johno3 Posted December 22, 2009 Author Report Posted December 22, 2009 Thank you very much to all those people that have given us feedback based on meetings or the practice session from Sunday. The Admin Team have started discussing the situation and will let you know in the near future. I would encourage as many drivers as possible to attend the upcoming meeting so we ca get our final piece of feedback before making the final decision. Cheers Johno
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